Talk:Terrifying rage
Incorrect changes Someone using IP 81.179.120.243 changed duration from 1d3 to 1d6 and the DC die roll from 1d10 to 1d20. I just checked the script x2_s2_terrage_a, and those changes are not correct. The paralysis duration is 1d3, and the roll is 1d10. The script by Georg Zoeller even includes the following comment: sorry but d20() was just too unbalancing for the game, if you are a rules layer, just put the d20 here... I've reverted the change. -- Austicke 08:52, 4 Nov 2005 (PST) (Dead link removed. --The Krit 22:19, 15 September 2008 (UTC)) Correct effect link? Panicked currently links to Paralysis, but the rest of the description implies that it's a fear effect. -- 7 July 2006 * It is a paralysis effect with the saves of a fear (the original design of the feat actually had a panic effect applied, but that was later replaced with paralysis). Immunity to fear, mindspells, paralysis, and even the property freedom will keep characters of a lower level safe from all its effects. All feats applying to fear or mindspells also work for this save. For those of equal or higher level (less than twice the level) it is strictly a fear save with the effect of lowering attack and saves. WhiZard 04:40, 27 September 2008 (UTC) Immunity Autofailure Contingencies and Limitations The note The saving throw is bugged as it will cause those immune to fear to automatically fail the save (without a roll). is misleading for 4 reasons: 1) Immunity from fear, if granted by feat (i.e. Aura of courage), still forces a saving throw with results dependent on that roll. 2) If the immunity from fear is granted solely by non-feat means OR in additionto the feat version, there is no saving throw and automatic failure occurs. 3) If any character without Aura of courage feat, PC or NPC, is granted both immunity to fear AND immunity to mind-affecting effects, there is always a saving throw. If the save result is success, the m-a immunity is not instituted (echoed on screen). If the save result is failure, the m-a immunity is instituted and avoids the rage effects. 4) If a character which is granted immunity to fear by feat AND by other means AND also is granted immunity to mind-affecting effects, there is no saving throw, with automatic success in avoiding the rage effects. The standard yellow echo about immunity to mind-affecting spells does not appear. Whether the source of mind-affecting immunity is granted by spell or by item property makes no difference. It overrides the immunity to fear in the manner described above. I have no suggestion on how to clarify the original note statement to account for all the contingencies, but the statement itself is incorrect for those instances that I have just outlined. Note: I have not tested "fear immunity source" dynamic for an immunity to fear granted by creature skin property... so that could potentially complicate the contingencies to the original statement even further. One issue that I cannot resolve is that the innate Will saves of a paladin (Aura of courage owner) are reduced by 10 in the saving throw calculation. I can suggest no reason for the penalty imposed. It is consistent, however, in every saving throw against the Terrifying Rage aura (i.e. Will vs. fear).--Iconclast (talk) 04:43, October 19, 2012 (UTC) * In #3, what do you mean by "is not instituted (echoed on screen)"? Also in #3, did you test failed saving throws when the opponent has at least as many hit dice as the barbarian? (Mind-affecting immunity blocking the paralysis effect is normal, but it would be rather unusual for that immunity to block penalties to attacks and saving throws.) --The Krit (talk) 06:19, October 19, 2012 (UTC) :* When the throw succeeds, there is no message about immunity to m-a spells displayed. Whether an immunity message ever gets displayed after a saving throw has occurred or not, well... I have no idea. It is only being mentioned as part of a comprehensive record without pasting the entire combat session into the post. And, no, haven't found an effect to counter the save/AB penalties (Negative Protection doesn't work). However, at least for the feat-based immunity, there is still a saving throw initiated. I focused primarily on the saving throw/autofailure issue. --Iconclast (talk) 15:34, October 19, 2012 (UTC) ::* So if we strip out some distracting details, we get: :::# Aura of courage by itself results in a normal saving throw roll. :::# Other sources of immunity to fear cause the roll to be skipped and the save to be failed (as currently described in the article). :::# In the absence of aura of courage, combining immunity to fear and immunity to mind-affecting results in a normal saving throw roll. :::# Combining aura of courage with another source of immunity to fear, plus immunity to mind-affecting causes the roll to be skipped and the save to be passed. ::: That's what you are reporting? --The Krit (talk) 19:32, October 19, 2012 (UTC) * Here's how I am reading this. 1 and 2) Aura of courage, unlike immunity to fear by effect or item property, does not cause an automatic success in a standard will save roll. This auto-success is interpreted as auto-failure by MySavingThrow(). 3) Mind-affect immunity displays a message to the PC when an effect of its type is blocked (e.g. paralysis). 4) Auto-success is assumed because there was no saving throw and the effect was blocked. Mind-affecting message was not given because another immunity that blocks paralysis (e.g. freedom) gave its message ("immune to paralysis") instead. 10:59, October 19, 2012 (UTC) :* That's pretty much it. Freedom never occurred to me as a counter. Negative Energy Protection doesn't work against the penalties. ::The wording of the original note appears to indicate that if the property or effect "immune to fear" has been applied to the character, that a saving throw will not be made under any circumstances. This is just not true, due to the feat-based version and additionally no autofailure if paralysis has been countered (< barb hostile level). --Iconclast (talk) 15:34, October 19, 2012 (UTC) ::*I am not seeing any saving throw displayed when immunity to fear comes either from the item property or the effect (with or without mind-affecting immunity). All paths have the WillSave() return 2 and the MySavingThrow() return 0. The feat aura of courage appears to be the lone exception, and the only thing I can reproduce from your description of the anomaly. 00:54, October 20, 2012 (UTC) :::* So you're saying point #3 is not true? (Or both 3 and 4?) --The Krit (talk) 02:14, November 14, 2012 (UTC) Intimidate requirement Does anyone know, off the top of their head, whether it is 25 skill RANKS or 25 skill LEVELS that are required here? -- 13:08, May 21, 2014‎ *Skill requirements for feats are always ranks and never levels. WhiZard (talk) 17:51, May 21, 2014 (UTC) :*Thanks for the clarification. Is this written anywhere? I can't think of any other skill dependant feats now I come to think of it, but there must be some. Also, is it worth noting in the Terrifying Rage article that this in fact means that 22 character levels are needed, rather than 21 (still with only 15 needing to be Barbarian)? Only implication is that you can't take it as the level 21 general feat I suppose. -- 17:14, 23 May 2014 (UTC) ::* There are several feats with skill requirements. Lasting inspiration, all epic spells, improved combat casting, all auto-metamagic feats, epic dodge, self concealment, epic skill focus, just to name the epic feats. But, yes there is no note in either the skill or feat article, though there is a note to this effect in the skill rank article. WhiZard (talk) 21:49, May 23, 2014 (UTC) ::* It's also mentioned in general feat. --The Krit (talk) 00:29, May 24, 2014 (UTC)